Not FTTP still relying on copper wire

[Smut]

Perhaps someone can explain to me how they are calling full fibre FTTP, the fibre goes to the ONT then via an Ethernet cable (copper wire) to the router therefore it is not full fibre.

[GD1]

@Smut  It is Full Fibre - FTTP is Fibre to the Premises, threfere as you have an ONT you have full fibre or fibre to the premises.

The ONT is required to converted the light signals to one a hub can translate, and as far as I'm aware, no ISP has a hub that has a inbuilt ONT.

I'm not sure what you are expecting Full Fibre to be, but feel free to enlighten the community with your understanding of full fibre.

[JimM1]

@Smut And as you are a home connection Fibre connected FTTP to the ONT is about as far as you need it to go. Anything after that point is good on various degrees of copper cable structure! 

[TimmyBGood]

@Smut .

FTTP is Fibre To The Premises.

'full fibre' is the phrase which Ofcom now insists that ISPs use to different the technology from Fibre To The Cabinet, aka 'part fibre'.

https://helpforum.sky.com/t5/Broadband-Talk/Changes-to-how-we-talk-about-Sky-Broadband/ 

[Smut]

The system you pay for is to the modem, not the OTN having a copper wire link in the system restricts the speed to the quality of the wire, If you care to mega your Ethernet cable you will find quite extreme variations, from research I have found most Ethernet cable are not really up for the job, but it still doesn't get away from the fact its not full fibre.

[TimmyBGood]

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@Smut wrote:

 I have found most Ethernet cable are not really up for the job, but it still doesn't get away from the fact its not full fibre.

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Ethernet cable built to the Cat5e specification is capable of multi-gigabit speed.

How do you imagine fibre all the way to a client device (and particularly a wireless one) could function?  There's zero speed drop over ethernet between ONT and router in any standard deployment and the signal has to be transformed from light to electrical signalling somewhere: the only alternative would be for ISPs to fit fibre media converters into their own hardware, which would make Openreach very unhappy regarding standardisation.

As I said, the 'full fibre' and 'part fibre' labels are intended to help consumers differentiate between broadband technologies rather than being precise technical terms.

Full-fibre networks are currently being deployed at pace, meaning customers are increasingly able to choose from a range of different network technologies for their broadband service. However, the term ‘fibre’ has previously been applied inconsistently by the telecoms industry and often used to describe different types of networks, leading to confusion among customers.

From today, broadband providers will need to be clear and unambiguous about whether the network they use is a new ‘full-fibre’ network – with fibre all the way to a customer’s home – or a ‘part-fibre’, ‘copper’, or ‘cable’ network. Providers will no longer be able to use the term ‘fibre’ on its own.

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/phones-and-broadband/bills-and-charges/customers-to-get-clearer-broadband-i... 

[GD1]

@Smut  Also you seem to be confusing ethernet cables which as @TimmyBGood  explains is multi gigabit, with the copper Telephone cable your FTTP line replaced.

Ethernet cables offer far more than the standard Openreach FTTP servi ce can currently deliver.   A decent Cat5E Ethernet cable is capable of 10gbps speed, with Cat6 & higher providing even higher speeds.

So you are getting Full Fibre.

An ONT ethernet port will be at the minimum a 1 Gigabit port also.  

[Smut]

My initial question was with regard to the incorrect expression FTTP, in reply to a remark about my copper wire I don't have it we are on aluminium cable! Irrespective of which cable used, we all know there are very good and very poor types. You can get fibre direct to modems which gives you full fibre not part fibre.

[TimmyBGood]

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@Smut wrote:

You can get fibre direct to modems which gives you full fibre not part fibre.

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Not on the national Openreach network, but the functional difference is non-existent.  

'part fibre' is FTTC, and copper-clad aluminium (CCA) cannot be used in Cat5e cable: it is found in non-Cat rated budget bulk ethernet reels, and anyone using these is doing themselves a disservice.  It's also present in the national phone network as a result of cost-saving in previous decades and does bad things to FTTC, ADSL and G.fast broadband.

[Smut]

Thank you all for your informed replies, I understand all of your replies. But still maintain we are yet again being mis sold by big companies by ambiguous wording. I leave you with a thought, why can't the OMT box be integrated into the modem, thus giving full FTTP.

[JimM1]

@Smut If you are not getting it the ONT is a modem, and the full fibre runs direct to it!

The Ethernet cable from the ONT MODEM is well capable off maxing the speed to the Sky Hub whichever one gets fitted!

[TimmyBGood]

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@Smut wrote:

why can't the OMT box be integrated into the modem, thus giving full FTTP.

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Because Openreach insists on the demarcation point at the end of their optical network distribution being their own Optical Network Terminal (clue is in the name) rather than random hardware from other sources.  It also simplifies the manufacturing of millions of ISP routers and makes absolutely no difference to network speed.

[TimmyBGood]

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@Smut wrote:

But still maintain we are yet again being mis sold by big companies by ambiguous wording. 

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As I've said a couple of times, using 'full fibre' rather than 'fibre' reduces ambiguity.  If you really want to be pedantic, 'Fibre To The Premises' is more literally correct than 'Fibre To The Router' (which isn't a thing)

[Chrisee]

@Smut there is a good practical reason why Openreach and other network operators supply the ONT as connecting fibre is far more complex than plugging in a cable. Microscopic particles of dust can severly affect data rates and the joins have to be optically perfect. The fibre strands are extremly delicate and easily damaged. Your concept of an ONT in the router is therefore impractical

In comparison an ethernet cable is far more robust and can easily exceed the data rates required on the lengths involved. 

[JimM1]

@Chrisee @GD1 @TimmyBGood The only ISP that i know off with Fibre direct all the way is VM on the latest Hub5x. And possibly more robust Fibre cable but you do need to treat it with extreme caution, that's what i tell my son, DON'T be messing with it, no ins/outs on the Fibre whatever if anything is wrong.... They also had to double cable as the VM Engineer did not have long enough to run from the External to the Internal Hub point, but has been working fine 2 years come Sept!