Installing Fibre - master socket downstairs, router upstairs

[KTSK]

Hi,  I'm looking to update from ADSL broadband to fibre.  Currently my phoneline comes into the house (from a little grey box at the front of the house) to a master socket in a hall cupboard.  From here I have a panasonic digital phone signal distributer plugged in, which sends the phone signal to two handsets in the house.  My router is currently  set up upstairs connected to an extension phone socket in my spare room, which is a set I'd like to keep.  Would the fibre set up still allow for my router to be upstairs?  How can this be linked to the modem I see BT Openreach need to install for fiber installation.  I see other posts of installations being put in places people don't want.  Thanks for any replies.

[peter-marlow+1966]

KTSK

Is your  grey box like the 1 in the photo

 this is the full fibre optic broadband box 

[Chrisee]

@KTSK Openreach are likely install  the new fibre cable external Customer Supply Point in a similar location as the current copper supply. The internal ONT need not be in excatly the same place but the standard fibre pigtial cable use to connect the the CSP is 10m long and so the ONT is usally mounted on the inside of the same wall. The hub is by default within a metre or so of the ONT but can be further away if you suplly a longer Ethernet cable. The engineers do try and give you what you want but practicalities and time restraints limit what thry can do. The enginerr decidescwhat is possible on the day but you can decline tge install if you want but pretty obviously being flexible is sensible.

Your existing phone witing is redundant and cant be reused. Fibre cables cannot be bent round sharp corners but you are free to tun ethernet cables yourself it you want. 

[KTSK]

No, not quite, I don't think, I'll check tomorrow and try to post a picture...

[Waveman]

When you change to fiber they will likely move your SkyTalk to digital, assuming your phone is with Sky. This means the internal phone wiring of your property will stop working. You plug your landline phone into your router.

if your current line is supplied underground, they will pull an external fiber to the new Customer Splice Point (CSP) basically a point where the fiber changes from external to internal. 

if you add a note to the order that your router is to be installed in a first floor room, your Openreach engineer will hopefully be able to accommodate. Putting the ONT where you want it. Your new router (unless you already have WiFi Max one, SR213) plugs with a short Ethernet cable into the ONT. you can, if required, use a Ethernet patch cable, up to 100m if required. 

It goes without saying, you want the ONT as close to your router as possible. 

The OR engineer (contractor) who did my install had lengths of internal fiber up to 30m. 

[Chrisee]

@Waveman While what you post applies in some cases it is unsafe to assume it applies to all. You apoear to have hit lucky on your install however notvall are as positive.

For example warning  Sky about a first floor placement for the ONT is sensible but it is the engineer's decsion on the day on what is possible and their flexibility varies especially with sub-contractors who are often paid on a per job basis. In practice Sky try to use their own engineers where ever possible but you may get a directly employed Openreach engineer or a sub-contractor, who you get is not something that can be controlled. Most are helpful but it needs to be apprecisted they all have time pressures. The key thing is to talk to the engineer explain what you would like and listen to them if it isnt fully possible as they have rules to follow about what can and cannot be done. Ladders have to be secured, flat roofs and unboared lofts are a no no etc

.While with underground feed the CSP is frequently installed prior to the installation day  for overhead lines the engineer will normally run the drop cable  from the pole and install the external CSP as part of the installation appointmeent. The standard fibre pigtail cable is 10m long but some engineers do have 30m cables on their van but these do not form part of the standard installation Sky pay for.so you cannot assume that will be available or be used. 

Sky control what hub you get and it is unsafe to assume every full fibre customers buying an Uktrafast service will getva Sky Max hub as in some cases Sky send out a "conversion kit" which is a short ethernet cable so the customer can reuse the Sky Broadband hub (SR203)they had before. The only way to guarantee a Sky Max hub is to add Sky WiFi Max to the subscription. 

.There is no requirement to have the hub near the ONT as there is no appreciable speed loss over Ethernet for example a basic Cat5e cable supports gigabit speeds up to 100m. Higher spec cable support higher speeds. It is sensible where the ONT is unavoidably badly placed for customers to use a longer ethernet cable so the hub can be a better position for WiFi as ethernet cable is far easier to run than fibre. Do not expect the engineer to do this for you it isnt part of their job.

[KTSK]

Hi peter-marlow+1966, my box isn't like that, no, it's much smaller (I looked nextdoor, I think my neighbour has what you have below..) so that will need updating then...

[KTSK]

I'm actually wondering if I could do some pre-work, just looking around my house and set up.  I wondered if I ask a private phone/broadband/wifi engineer out to look and maybe "pre-install" some ethernet cable from my downstairs cupboard up to the bedroom which is directly above.  Currently the wire for the phone extension runs from the master socket in that cupboard up and through the floor to the extension socket in the room above.  I'm even wondering if it easier to put some kind of ethernet socket in the cupboard, run the wire outside and up and into the bedroom (both cupboard and bedroom are on the outside wall) then have an ethernet socket in place of the phone extension....  I added some photos to show the set up currently...  I know I would pay but hopefully having organised myself to install the extension wiring I could be more selective...

[KTSK]

Or wondering about the plug in adapters  to transmit ethernet over the mains.. I have a socket in the cupboard and one upstairs next to the phone extension.  As long as they are on the same ring then mayb the ONT could plug using ethernet into the adapter and it could run upstairs to anothe adapter to plug into the new router/hub?  like this https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-G-hn2400-Passthrough-Powerline-Configuration/dp/B0BNQV47WD/ref=sr_1... 

[Waveman]

I did do some pre-install before the OR contractor turned up. I already wanted the fiber to terminate in my garage next to my routers and servers. I figured that OR would only want to come through the wall into the lounge and then put the ONT on the wall, not what I wanted!

I ran a single mode fibre from where the connection would come into the garage to the rack, 15m terminated with APC/SC connectors. When the OR contractor arrived he was doing a hybrid install (i.e. was doing the underground pull and the internal as one job) As they do a fusion splice at the change over from external to internal, he gave me the internal fibre to pull in while he did the underground and external work, mounting the CST on the garage wall. I already had surface mounted trunking around the garage. This saved time and allowed him to be sorted in two hours.

As has been said by @Chrisee  it depends on how accomodating your OR engineer is, if they are a contractor or work directly for Openreach, have the supplies and time constraints. They are only there to install the fibre to the home and get the ONT running.

Running your own ethernet cable from the ONT to the upstairs room doesnt require any thing too complex to be able to do it. you can even buy tool less RJ45 sockest and plugs. The CAT5e or CAT6 cable isnt that expensive. If your run your ethernet cable outdoors, make sure you buy external twisted pair, the internal stuff will breakdown when exposded to UV. This can all be done after the OR engineer is finished, as they won't want to be hanging about waiting for you.

You can use powerline adapters, they rely on your mains wiring, as long as the run is not too long they do work but depending on what you intend to run over them may limit your bandwidth. They are not too keen on multi plugs and wont work if there is any filtering on them.

I have used them when installing EV charge points & the Wi-Fi is a bit marginal in larger installs. EV Charge points dont require much bandwidth so they do work in this application very well, provided the house isn't too massive!