Sky Glass Delivered

[Anonymous]

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@Q-tips wrote:

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@oj01 wrote:

@Q-tips I have zero knowledge of how broadband speeds work. But what I do know is that Sky have stated that there is no limit on the concurrent use of the Pucks like there is on Q Mini's (other than purchasing 6), subject to the customer having 'sufficient' broadband speed.

One suggestion elsewhere is that the Glass and Pucks are grabbing whatever bandwidth they can. So, is it possible that while a single Puck is using 20 or 30, it doesn't follow that switching on another doubles that usage? 

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@oj01 unless the user throttles certain types of connection, most downloads will grab whatever bandwidth they can (subject to the speed of the server), which could explain why someone from this parish reported 83Mbps being consumed by his Glass TV alone on a test yesterday. But the issue I was raising isn't the maximum speed of a puck connection but the minimum speed requirement for a puck to deliver viable 4K content.

Sky obviously need to advise buyers what that number is, depending on the number of TVs making independent connections to the streaming servers. Their Glass FAQ says 25Mbps for trouble-free 4K viewing on one screen (10Mbps for a standard 1080p stream) and there's no fat in that since their Sky broadband FAQ separately states that we need 30Mbps for a smooth 4K stream.

The few real world reports we have read so far suggest that there is no difference in bandwidth demand between pucks but that the Glass TV does consume more than a puck. The best real world guide reported yesterday was that a TV was using 35-40Mbps at the same time as two pucks were using 20-30Mbps each. But this might have been a case where the devices were simply grabbing what was available in order to deliver a stream more quickly at the beginning. Another user with the same devices but less bandwidth might report lower throughput but maybe a longer delay at the start - assuming that some form of local buffering is needed. It could also be the case that more data (eg. software) is pushed to some devices when needed.

This well-informed website reckons that with typical other concurrent demands on a broadband service, the safe speed for a 4K stream is 50Mbps. It also lists the different transmission rates by verious apps.

So Sky have to be very careful with their advised minimum speeds. If the real world requirement turns out to be greater than the advised minimum then Sky will be lumbered with a lot of refunds and returns; and the launch of Glass will be an almighty flop.

The pucks are supposed to make independent connections to the Sky servers so there is no basis for arguing that a puck 4K stream would by default be any smaller or faster than a Glass TV 4K stream - although it may be the case that a TV consumes more "overhead" data than a puck and therefore needs a bigger slice of the pie. Pucks may report differing speed/throughput depending upon what they are receiving and where they are situated.  And if pucks can't operate at the advised speed then they may start buffering and/or downgrading the picture quality - or do nothing.

All in all, it seems misleading to imply - as the Glass registration process does - that 35Mbps is sufficient for smooth operation of two concurrent and different 4K streams to the TV and a puck. The advised 25Mbps for a single UHD stream is borderline according to other references and it can't be possible to add another UHD stream at full quality at an all-in cost of 35Mbps - even if Sky think that all the user's other domestic BB overheads are built into the initial 25Mbps advisory.

Worse,Sky then add nothing to the advised BB speed if you add a second or subsequent puck to your order. The 35Mbps advisory speed applies to 1, 2, 3 and 4 pucks! This is nonsense.

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According to someone i spoke to at sky yesterday, it also depends on what you're watching.  A live 4k football match is going to use a lot more bandwith than a streaming 4k movie.  My puck can't even handle a 4k football match when there's nothing else in the house using internet.  It's actually having trouble streaming hd sport aswell at times.  The 4k footy was using around 58mbps which is clearly far too much for people with "standard" broadband.  I'm hopeful this will all be ironed out in time though.

[mcskygo]

@gizmo120 I just got this text from sky:

"We sent you a message in error yesterday, asking you to sign your credit agreement. If you've already signed it, please ignore. Sorry."

[HughieEb1]

Hi 

I was told you had to order from a sky stand in a shopping centre before they go on sale online got mine coming next Wednesday 

55" dark blue multi room

[Q-tips]

@Anonymous - there's at least one other report today of live footy consuming around 58Mbps but it presumably doesn't need that much. What matters is what data do they drop from the live sport feed if they can only grab 30Mbps? Does the picture quality degrade? Alternatively, how does it impair viewability with buffering, etc?

Either the live footy needs 58Mbps to deliver evey 4K pixel and all the attendant bells and whistles of a pristine feed or something gets compromised if only half that speed is available. It presumably isn't sending you extraneous data (trailers, promos, software, whatever) which could be dropped if necessary without any penalty.

[stevemace]

There is absolutely is cloud recording. If something isn't available from a catch-up service then it will cloud record. Try recording a live football match or your local BBC news and it will be cloud recorded from the point you added it to your playlist. 

[Anonymous]

Unfortunately for me that isn't good enough and it's still a downgrade on Sky Q.  If Sky Glass doesn't let you record whatever you want with the ability to then subsequently fast forward (which you can't do on catch up apps without paying) then it's a downgrade. 

[londonfox82]

Local BBC News doesn't show in the Tv Guide so you can't see it let alone add it to the playlist 

[CyberFriday]

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@Q-tips wrote:

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@oj01 wrote:

I don't think that's correct. Yes, you can have 3 Glass TVs (well you can't yet) and 6 Pucks, but there is no restrictions on the ratio. So you can have 1 TV and 6 Pucks, all running simultaneously. 

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I think further clarification fom Sky is needed. The relevant known fact I can offer is that when placing dummy Glass orders today via the Sky Glass registration page, I was shown an advisory notice about broadband speed after I had specified my package (UHD), number of TVs (1) and number of pucks (various quantities ordered).

My order which contained zero pucks prompted an advisory screen that I should have at least 25Mbps of broadband speed.

When I increased the number of pucks to 1, the advisory changed to 35Mbps.

And the advisory stayed at 35Mbps when ordering 2, 3 or 4 pucks (I wasn't allowed to order more).

This indicates that the maximum permitted number of concurrent and different UHD streams is two (one for the TV and one for the first puck). Otherwise, the advisory speed would have been increased for each additional puck. (The best real-world estimate we have seen from a new owner is that each puck consumes 20-30Mbps when streaming at 4K.)

So it seems that you can own up to 6 pucks but only stream UHD concurrently to two devices. Unless you or anyone can offer an alternative logical explanation for the advised BB speed not increasing with each puck.

(Not that a recommended increase of 10Mbps when adding a single puck to my UHD order makes sense since that is only enough to support a non-UHD stream, according to Sky.)

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@Q-tips Sky's broadband speed notices you posted uses some interesting wording "Good News is You Can Enjoy Sky Glass Through WiFi From Any Provider...."  So, have they made a typo and actually mean from any non sky internet broadband provider ? Or are they saying you can just hitch GLASS via wifi, not ethernet ? Or can you connect the GLASS tv to one internet provider, say your landline and then the pucks via a mobile provider (for those lucky enough to have the right coverage) ?  Or just hook into your neighbours wifi (not that the law abiding Sky community folks would do that) 😉

[Kingcreedo]

@MikeyMK Hi Mikey, if this is the 43" size can you please upload a pic of the Vesa sizing and what is the actual horizontal by vertical sizing please

Thanks.

[sceptic101]

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@londonfox82 wrote:

Local BBC News doesn't show in the Tv Guide so you can't see it let alone add it to the playlist 

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Hopefully thats a bug.

[londonfox82]

Confirms by Sky as a bug. 

[Q-tips]

@CyberFriday, I suspect that's wishful thinking on your part. But for anyone who can't get fast enough broadband, there are 5G home routers available delivering around 150Mbps if the signal is decent. Unlimited data for £55pm (EE) ain't cheap but beggars can't be shoosers.

[CyberFriday]

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@Q-tips wrote:

@CyberFriday, I suspect that's wishful thinking on your part. But for anyone who can't get fast enough broadband, there are 5G home routers available delivering around 150Mbps if the signal is decent. Unlimited data for £55pm (EE) ain't cheap but beggars can't be shoosers.

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@Q-tips  No wishful thinking on my part. Just a general observation/question.  My measily  22Mb Sky broadband trounces the 6Mb mobile coverage I can get.   Roll on fttp. No urge at the moment to break into Glass. Too early for image quality, reliability and general "features" for me.  Although with fttp i could be more inerested in a puck only solution.  

[stysam1]

Order was supposed to be delivered tomorrow and as I was away had my daughter travel on 3 busses and leave her 15 month daughter with her other half for the night only to get an email saying there is a problem and it won't be delivered until Tuesday next week.  Not impressed with the new service if this is how it is going to be cancel mi e asap

[Q-tips]

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@CyberFriday wrote:

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@Q-tips wrote:

@CyberFriday, I suspect that's wishful thinking on your part. But for anyone who can't get fast enough broadband, there are 5G home routers available delivering around 150Mbps if the signal is decent. Unlimited data for £55pm (EE) ain't cheap but beggars can't be shoosers.

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@Q-tips  No wishful thinking on my part. Just a general observation/question.  My measily  22Mb Sky broadband trounces the 6Mb mobile coverage I can get.   Roll on fttp. No urge at the moment to break into Glass. Too early for image quality, reliability and general "features" for me.  Although with fttp i could be more inerested in a puck only solution.  

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I too was a puck wannabe last week. This week I'm not. I couldn't live with that UI. Maybe when Sky spend a billion or two on servers and do it properly I'll think again. (If they include a reminder function and drop the FF surcharge, natch.)