Dolby Digital Plus no Atmos without eARC?

[Parsen]

Hello,

This has probaly been asked many times and I apologise in advance.

So, I have a 2106 Samsung 4K tv with no eARC, only ARC. Recently bought a Sonos Beam Gen 2 with two SL Ones as surrounds. With Sky Q box set to dolby digital plus I get sound on all programs other than when playing something with Atmos, then I get nothing at all. 

I reaslie that I need eARC for true Atmos but why cant the Sky box play the best it can when set to dolby digital plus, that being dolby digital?

I have got the Arcana box but not using it as it gave too many sound drop outs and connection issues, it drove us all mad so I ditched it.

I suspect I have answered my own question but thought I would try here and check with the experts.

[Parsen]

With the distinct lack of replies I guess I did answer my own question 

[nigea99]

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@Parsen wrote:

Hello,

This has probaly been asked many times and I apologise in advance.

So, I have a 2106 Samsung 4K tv with no eARC, only ARC. Recently bought a Sonos Beam Gen 2 with two SL Ones as surrounds. With Sky Q box set to dolby digital plus I get sound on all programs other than when playing something with Atmos, then I get nothing at all. 

I reaslie that I need eARC for true Atmos but why cant the Sky box play the best it can when set to dolby digital plus, that being dolby digital?

I have got the Arcana box but not using it as it gave too many sound drop outs and connection issues, it drove us all mad so I ditched it.

I suspect I have answered my own question but thought I would try here and check with the experts.

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Hi @Parsen 

I didn't spot your post & need to have a think to see if I can assist although I have neither the Samsung TV nor Sonos Bar

You don't need eARC for Atmos from SKY or currently apps such as Netflix, Prime & Disney Plus as they do use DD+ with a bandwith <1Mb which ordinary ARC can cope with  & I can get Atmos on my Yamaha Receiver from  TV (both are ARC capable not eARC)

You only need eARC for sources using TrueHD or similar (such as Blu-Ray & 4K players) as the bandwith is often around 3-4Mbps & sometimes up to  8Mbps or more

Can you try watching something from the SKY Q box that is Atmos & as a test link the SKY Q box direct to the Sonos and see if you get Atmos OK (I haven't checked  to see if the SOnos has pass through capability so if it hasn't then I appreciate during the test you may not be able to watch, as such, but just do the test for sound) 

[nigea99]

hi @Parsen 

Thinking about it, I wonder if your TV is not passing through Dolby Digital Plus.

With the Setting set to DD+ on SKY Q it still only uses (i.e. sends) ordinary Dolby Digital for virtually everything  (or PCM for SD channels)  & tends to only output DD+ only with Atmos material

Thus if your TV is not passing through DD+ this might explain why you are getting sound most of the time but not when watching Atmos material

That said,  recently  I have noted the new UHD Sports channels do sometimes (or is that mostly)   output DD+ without being Atmos (for example watching the Golf on the SKY Sports Main Event UHD yesterdaY)  & the F1 UHD channel - so if you have the Sports pack can you check the F1 UHD channel - as I write this it is outputting 2.0 channel  DD+

[Parsen]

Hi @nigea99 

Thank you for taking the time to reply and for your very detailed and informative comments. 

I have done some extensive testing and been in touch with Samsung and it would appear that the TV is at fault here. There is no option on the TV for DD+, only DD. There is DTS (greyed out) and DTS NEO 2.5 which I beleive is unique to Samsung and a faux suround. I'm assuming that DTS would allow Atmos? I will speak with their tech team this morning to see if they can cast any light on why the DD+ option is not shown when the TV does support it. For info my TV model is UE43KS7500

[nigea99]

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@Parsen wrote:

Hi @nigea99 

Thank you for taking the time to reply and for your very detailed and informative comments. 

I have done some extensive testing and been in touch with Samsung and it would appear that the TV is at fault here. There is no option on the TV for DD+, only DD. There is DTS (greyed out) and DTS NEO 2.5 which I beleive is unique to Samsung and a faux suround. I'm assuming that DTS would allow Atmos? I will speak with their tech team this morning to see if they can cast any light on why the DD+ option is not shown when the TV does support it. For info my TV model is UE43KS7500

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hi @Parsen 

DTS is a rival tech and thus Atmos is Dolby only  - there is an equivalent to Dolby Atmos called DTS:X which some discs carry (Harry Potter 4K/UHD  discs have great DTS:X sound) but I don't know if any streaming use DTS let alone DTS:X

BTW Atmos & DTS:X are effectively Extensions which means they piggy back on / extend the main carrier which is why Atmos can be used with both Dolby Digital plus (a lower rate,  compressed signal) and the uncompressed  Dolby True HD - I can't remember the compressed versions of DTS off the top of my head - the uncompreessed version being DTS MasterHD which is more or less the standard on Blu-Ray discs

Edit : I should mention that Atmos does rely on DD plus and cannot be used with the older ordinary 'non plus' version.

I hope there is an option for  your TV to pass through the DD+ stream although from what you say that may not be possible or if you are lucky via a firmware upgrade.  (Unfortunately a quick look at the Sonos Beam looks like, as I thought was the case, that it doesn't have an additional HDMI to allow SKY Q to be plugged directly to it) 

[Parsen]

hello @nigea99 

I have deicided to give the HD Fury Arcana another run out in the hope it would be stable and give the Atmos I want. It is all plugged in, working and with the Sky Q audio output set to DD +. I can now get sound on all channels and especially those with an Amtos audio via the app on the Sky Q box. However, the best I can get in DD + 5.1 and never Atmos. All the cables are connected as they should be so any thoughts as to why I dont get Atmos when the program or film on Amazon Prime states that it is Atmos?

[TimmyBGood]

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@Parsen wrote:

For info my TV model is UE43KS7500

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Typically sets of that vintage cannot do Atmos passthrough, even if they are capable of producing Atmos from internal apps.

[nigea99]

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@Parsen wrote:

hello @nigea99 

I have deicided to give the HD Fury Arcana another run out in the hope it would be stable and give the Atmos I want. It is all plugged in, working and with the Sky Q audio output set to DD +. I can now get sound on all channels and especially those with an Amtos audio via the app on the Sky Q box. However, the best I can get in DD + 5.1 and never Atmos. All the cables are connected as they should be so any thoughts as to why I dont get Atmos when the program or film on Amazon Prime states that it is Atmos?

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1st thing is that Atmos is only available on the UHD versions - so are you definitely downloading the UHD versions ?

2nd thing is that it is not unknown for content to be labelled incorrectly

(although probably more not stating Atmos when it has it rather than stating it has Atmos when it doesn't )

Can you give specific examples  of something you have tried ?

[Parsen]

hello @TimmyBGood 

Yes I appreciate the TV is of an age now but the Sonos Beam Gen 2 is doing all the heavy lifting to get Atmos, or am I wrong?

[TimmyBGood]

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@Parsen wrote:

the Sonos Beam Gen 2 is doing all the heavy lifting to get Atmos, or am I wrong?

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Is the Q box connected by HDMI into the television set or the Sonos hardware?

[Parsen]

Hi @nigea99 

I have tested it with Carnival Row on Amazon Prime. Although not a UHD version I dont believe.

Not downloaded anything as yet from Sky which I know is in UHD. But surely you can have Atmos without UHD?

[nigea99]

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@Parsen wrote:

Hi @nigea99 

I have tested it with Carnival Row on Amazon Prime. Although not a UHD version I dont believe.

Not downloaded anything as yet from Sky which I know is in UHD. But surely you can have Atmos without UHD?

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Yes Carnval row on Prime is Atmos  🙂  

Afraid Atmos is only available on UHD for any SKY content 

[Parsen]

@TimmyBGood Q box is connected to the HD Arcana as is the Sonos Beam and then connected to the TV via the One Connect Box and into the ARC HDMI port

[Parsen]

@nigea99 so anything Amazon Prime via the TV app should output Atmos even thought not UHD?