How long for FTTP to 'settle'?

[TimmyBGood]

@StuXxxxx @Anonymous 

'No spare ports' means the current ONT is a single WAN model and so cannot host more than one ISP service because there's nowhere to plug in a second router.  This is different to upstream capacity issues.

[Anonymous]

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@StuXxxxx wrote:

As I should have mentioned before, GPON is the system FTTP is currently based on.

I’m not an expert here but from what I understand:  “Single Dwelling Unit Residential” is a normal residential house, (as opposed to an MDU – Multiple Dwelling Unit, e.g. a block of flats.  Lots more potential problems with installing in these).  OH is overhead.  As you said, it comes via poles.

ONT is Optical Termination Unit, the optical equivalent of a modem.  Now, “no spare ports” is interesting.  Are you sure this bit doesn’t say OLT?  The other end of the fibre from the ONT is the OLT – Optical Line Terminal.  This serves multiple lines and there is a limit to how many ports it has.  “No spare ports” does suggest to me it is at maximum capacity.

No idea about Speedtest but I still use it.

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I copy & pasted the BT Wholesale line from the test.

 I've just run a Fast com test and it's given me it's customary 150Mbps (I did manage to get it to 140Mbps earlier but only because I still had ProtonVPN connected, I do obviously disconnect when testing, it loses about 7-8Mbps normally). I tested with Speedtest net immediately it finised and got 74Mbps.

If  Speedtest is accurate (this is the Windows 10 App although the website always gives the same figures) then so far this morning I've had 1x 74Mbps, 2x <90Mbps, 3x <100Mbps, 1x <120Mbps & 4x 150Mbps

It's the inconsistency that's doing my head in.

[Anonymous]

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@TimmyBGood wrote:

@StuXxxxx @Anonymous 

'No spare ports' means the current ONT is a single WAN model and so cannot host more than one ISP service because there's nowhere to plug in a second router.  This is different to upstream capacity issues.

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Ahh, so that just refers to the internal ONT then? Cheers.

[Anonymous]

I'm still having the same issues (along with micro stutters on Netflix) but I have noticed a peculiar effect when I exported the Speedtest net results as a csv file.

I've been trialling a free ProtonVPN service which goes via the Netherlands. Obviously I usually disconnect when testing but I do have 20 results out of 135 which were done while going through Amsterdam. All 20 are at >140Mbps (the loss from 150Mbps is expected going through the VPN).

Around 50 are <100Mbps and only 35 >150Mbps out of the remaining 115 results with the VPN disconnected.

I'm at a loss to explain that, any ideas?

[Anonymous]

Well that was my (unneeded) 'settling in' period done and dusted and all I got off them was "speeds between sites can vary" 😞

I've put an order in for Vodafone as Sky don't seem to care. If it wasn't for the wife I'd have cancelled the TV at the same time.

[Anonymous]

Sigh, so much for Vodafone. They are quite the most inept company going regardless of product. I have been bit before by them so should have known better, third time I definitely will be shy 😞

I talked to Sky again today and got someone sensible who has escalated it for me, annoyingly I forgot to tell him about the quirk of using a VPN 'solving' the issue so I'll have to wait on their contact in the next 2 or 3 days..

[Chrisee]

@Anonymous I find speed test results need to be compared like with like so stick with one site. Sky and Openreach seem to like Fast.com which is a Netflix service. With Ookla (Speedtest.net etc) the test site can vary try to make sure you test on the same reasonably local test site. Also dont discount that devices on your network can be usung bandwidth for updates and housekkeeping while supposedly idle. 

Although in theory there is a possibility of contention with up to 32 connections sharing 10Gb/s back to the exchange it seems from what is known as explained in this thread  from the Thinkbroadband forum it is very rare in practice as few users use more than a fraction of the bandwidth they pay for. But if all of your neighbours are into mass file sharing you maybe unlucky.😀 In my opinion the bandwidth of the backhaul from the exchange to Sky is far more likely to cause contention.

[Anonymous]

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@Chrisee wrote:

@Anonymous I find speed test results need to be compared like with like so stick with one site. Sky and Openreach seem to like Fast.com which is a Netflix service. With Ookla (Speedtest.net etc) the test site can vary try to make sure you test on the same reasonably local test site. Also dont discount that devices on your network can be usung bandwidth for updates and housekkeeping while supposedly idle. 

Although in theory there is a possibility of contention with up to 32 connections sharing 10Gb/s back to the exchange it seems from what is known as explained in this thread  from the Thinkbroadband forum it is very rare in practice as few users use more than a fraction of the bandwidth they pay for. But if all of your neighbours are into mass file sharing you maybe unlucky.😀 In my opinion the bandwidth of the backhaul from the exchange to Sky is far more likely to cause contention.

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Fast.com always comes back with full speed 150Mbps (minus the expected overhead losses if used with a VPN active).

Speedtest.net is all over the place from one test to the next even when doing test after test except when using the VPN when it never varies from it's circa 145Mbps.

The above are always done from a wired PC with nothing else consuming bandwidth and nothing else running on the PC (confirmed by the agent yesterday who stated that I've done everything possible to maximise the download).

I've tried lots of other speed tests a few times and get speeds all over the place again. Speedof.me for instance has never hit 60Mbps or greater unless using the VPN when it always hits 150Mbps+

Time of day makes no difference so given the quirk with the VPN service it looks to be 100% an issue with Sky's exchange equipment or software. The VPN is just circumventing it somehow. My knowledge of the subject stops there I'm afraid.

The agent I spoke to seems to think if they can't resolve it then they won't hold me to the 18 month contract. If it comes to that I'll just have to pay more for BT's offering. If I do move that will finally push me to moving mobile to O2 directly as well. The TV will have to remain for now for the wife but somewhere down the line I'll dump that too.

[Chrisee]

@Anonymous dont follow your logic that its got to be Sky's network. The results you get with Fast.com indicate your connection is operating as promised. You can check the validity of that by doing some download tests such as those here https://www.thinkbroadband.com/download. While on that site use their speedtest which is very reliable

No idea why you get variable results with Speedtest.net but as it uses third party servers to run the test you can get variation. I find the Ookla apps pretty consistent so use those rather than the website and always test on reasonably local servers that I know give me consistent results.

[Anonymous]

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@Chrisee wrote:

@Anonymousdont follow your logic that its got to be Sky's network. The results you get with Fast.com indicate your connection is operating as promised. You can check the validity of that by doing some download tests such as those here https://www.thinkbroadband.com/download. While on that site use their speedtest which is very reliable

No idea why you get variable results with Speedtest.net but as it uses third party servers to run the test you can get variation. I find the Ookla apps pretty consistent so use those rather than the website and always test on reasonably local servers that I know give me consistent results.

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I've used the thinkbroadband before and like Fast.com it shows no issues with around 90 seconds to download the 1GB file and the speed tests being excellent. They are the only 2 speedtests I've tried that doesn't have a problem.

It's not just speedtest.net giving weird results as other multiple sites are all over the place too. I usually use the Ookla speedtest App on the PC rather than the browser.

Surely if using a VPN and going via Holland negates any of these issues then the promlem is with Sky's configuration or systems somewhere?

You could say that it's only certain speed test sites that are affected but of course nobody knows what else is affected. I'm paying £28 a month for (upto) 150Mbps, not 150Mbps occassionaly but sometimes only 60Mbps.

[Anonymous]

Well I gave them a week to call back after it was escalated and being promised it would be witin 72 hours so I'm just getting written confirmation that I can leave penalty free.

Strangely the website version of speedtest.net now works fine (other sites still broken) while the app itself is still returning speeds all over the place. Given they're using the same servers and both work fine through a VPN I can only surmise that they've whitelisted the website version but are still managing to throttle or manage bandwidth for the connection somehow.

I do suspect that they know what's causing it but won't or can't change it so are hoping that I just accept it. I hate being lied to.

BT may be dearer but I've seen nothing that says that they do this.

[Chrisee]

@Anonymous sounds like something is affecting that one speedtest really cannot follow your logic its a Sky issue. 

[StuXxxxx]

@Anonymous

Well, if I’m honest, I’m a former Sky customer and currently with BT.  Retired tech so I tend to browser all these forums just out of casual interest.  Been with BT about 7 years.  Been out of contract for past three years as contemplating moving house, so don’t want a new contract.  (Move didn’t happen because of Covid).

Just a little anecdote about BT for you to ponder.  Couple of years back I used to get 58/59Mb/s down 18/19Mb/s up, on FTTC.  Consistent for about the first 5 years.  During Covid, all the ISPs are boasting “Oh, we’ve got plenty of bandwidth to cope with working from home” etc.  At the same time, behind the scenes, my speeds drop to 55/56Mb/s down and a very clear capping at 16.99 Mb/s up.  They’ve been that ever since.  Oh, and just by coincidence, the package that I would recontract to if I do so today has also been regraded to 50Mb/s.

Bottom line is, they’re all fiddling rotten.  Doesn’t matter where you go.  I respect principle of moving to make the point, though.  Just don’t expect things to be any better.  In fact, time I moved back to Sky, I think.

[Anonymous]

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@Chrisee wrote:

@Anonymoussounds like something is affecting that one speedtest really cannot follow your logic its a Sky issue. 

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Because it's not just the one speedtest site as I've mentioned a few times. Of course you can't test 'normal' websites so I don't know if they're being managed.

Why would the web version differ to their own app excepting when using a VPN when they suddenly match? Why was the web version all over the place from the start but has now miraculously "fixed itself"?

There is either a misconfiguration of their DNS service (presuming that could affect websites differently, I don't know myself), or it's traffic management.

[Anonymous]

Finally had a Sky engineer visit yesterday, he replaced the router and even the cable to the PC to no avail (as expected TBH).

He was as puzzled as me as to why it's doing this but agreed that it must be at the exchange end although he couldn't tell me much more than that. 

I've decided to just let it roll as the likes of Steam work perfectly well and see if there's any further degradation over time.