Billing

[Xasperated]

Sky took too much money from our account for 2 months after we downgraded. On noticing this error I called Customer Services and was advised on a course of action which included claiming a payment back from my bank and cancelling the direct debit. I was worried that this may affect my contract or the channels I receive but was assured by more than one adviser that this was the way to progress.

In light of this I must admit to my amazement when I discovered yesterday that our channels were blocked! Not only this we could not record any programmes or even watch anything we had stored even though we had obviously paid for this!

Once again I had to call Sky (at my expense) only to be told that some sort of miscalculation had been made by their advisers and my account was now in debit. As we have no recurring payment set up we could not have our account unblocked unless we agreed to give direct debit instructions over the phone. I have refused to do this as I now have no confidence in Sky's ability to take the correct amount of money from my account. A manager has now removed the debit from our account and, despite admitting we now owe Sky nothing until 06 July 2011 refuses to unblock our account until Sky have details that will enable them to start stealing money from our account again.

On cheecking my acount details on the website this morning I was astounded when it said that I had removed Sky TV!

I am afraid that my recent dealings with Sky have left a very sour taste as I feel we are being blamed for simply following their instructions to remedy their mistake and now they claim we am stuck in to them for another 6 months. Surely Sky are in breach of contract not us!

I have emailed Sky rerarding this matter but 10 days later I am still waiting for the courtesy of a reply.

[PaulEK]

You should never remove debit details from an account even if it's in dispute, by leaving no billable details on the account you have breached the terms and conditions of the account. How are Sky in breach of contract for you not giving payment details that can be used? The advisor advised you to remove the direct debit instruction but then it is your responsibility to provide alternative payment instructions.

Instead of waiting on the email why not follow it up with a recorded delivery letter to the complaints department, this will kick start the official complaint procedure and may help sort this out a bit sooner.

[Xasperated]

PaulEK:

Thank you for your reply.

I was told by a Sky adviser to cancel the direct debit and then we would be able to set up a new mandate once all the problems had been solved to our satisfaction. I thought that this was possibly a breach of the terms and conditions but was assured by the adviser that it would not affect my viewing or my contract. I even spoke to another adviser who confirmed this to be the correct action to take.

The adviser who originally told me to cancel arranged to call me back two days later which she did and again confirmed that I had done the right thing.

At no point was I told that I would have to provide alternative payment instructions until things were sorted out so I was somewhat surprised to have my channels blocked due to yet another mistake by Sky! To add insult to injury on checking my Sky account online it states that I have removed Sky TV when this is clearly not the case!

As far as breach of contract goes I cannot possibly see how I can have breached a contract when I simply followed instructions from the other party! If anything Sky have breached the contract by not providing the services paid for!

[PaulEK]

Ask for a call recording or tell them you are going to use the data act/ freedom of information act to get a copy of all data they hold for you as there should be full notes on the system if you were advised to do something. It may cost you an admin fee but it would also cost Sky dearly if there is anything in the notes to give weight to your argument with them.

If they cannot supply a recording of the call where you were advised to do it and there are no notes stating you were advised to do it then proof is a problem and without proof you cannot show you are not in breach of contract (which you were as soon as you removed the ability for them to take payment.)

Sky is only in breach if they are not providing the service that you have paid for and YOU are complying with the terms of your contract with THEM. Unfortunately contracts are often weighed more heavily in favour of the people that actually write them.

[Xasperated]

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Sky is only in breach if they are not providing the service that you have paid for and YOU are complying with the terms of your contract with THEM. Unfortunately contracts are often weighed more heavily in favour of the people that actually write them.

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Surely Sky must be in breach of contract if they are taking £62.50 from my account but only allowing me to watch channels worth £30.75!

[PaulEK]

Billing errors are seen as mistakes and not breaches I expect. You may find one of the advisors sees your thread and asks to help, if they do you may well get a fast response and resolution but initiating the DD again is something that must happen when they ask for it.

If they then screw up on billing you dispute it and push a formal complaint at the complaints address, it's a pain but you must never stop a DD for a running service, no matter what service, as it immediately puts you on the back foot against the provider

[Xasperated]

Is it possible Sky advisers are told to encourage customers to cancel direct debits in order to put them "on the back foot"?

We do not all have the indepth knowledge that you do PaulEK and can only trust what we are told by the advisers at that time. I asked the relevant questions and was assured that cancelling my direct debit was correct or they would be taking another £62.50 from my account as they are apparently unable to stop this process within 14 days of the billing date!

I know it is probably not considered a valid defence but  "I was only obeying orders"!

[Robert]

Hi Xasperated, 

I'm sorry to hear that this has happened and can appreciate this has been frustrating for you. In your case it would appear that the money was due to be taken from your account and this was picked up within the 14 day window for the direct debit payment coming from your account.

With Direct Debit, we apply to your bank 14 days before the billing date to start the process to retreive the money for your subscription, we do not take the money from your account until the payment due date. If a change occurs to your billing or account within 14 days of the payment due date it cannot be applied or affect the current direct debit process and is deferred to the following months bill.

In this case the only way to stop the money being taken from your account was to cancel the direct debit until the amount on your account was cleared by a manager or team leader with authorisation. Once this has been completed we can re-set the direct debit details which will start the billing process off again.

Our systems will automatically block an account where there is an amount overdue and this has not been paid with a set period of time and no continuous payment details available. Due to this we are unable to unblock an account until continuous payment details are provided.

I appreciate there is some confusion regarding your My Sky account showing that the TV subscription is cancelled, this can be fixed relatively quickly if the account is re-instated and has only occurred as the system cannot continue to process the subscription due to the lack of billing information.

I notice you have mentioned that the issue has been fixed relating to the amount on your bill. If you contact our Customer Help team to provide continuous payment details we can re-instate your services.

[Xasperated]

Hi Robert,

Thank you for your reply.

I initially brought the matter to Sky's attention more than 14 days before the billing date so I have very little faith that if I now reinstate the direct debit an incorrect amount will not be taken from my account when the next bill is due.

I was clearly told to cancel the direct debit and also claim back one month as this would leave my account  approximately £12 in CREDIT!

After being given so many "promises" by Sky why should I trust you with my bank account details? I owe Sky nothing and should at least be able to watch the services I have paid for until I do actually fall behiund with my payments!

I have tried to sort this by email (no replies), live chat (not working or all advisers busy) and numerous phone calls (my expense or if called back on a mobile and the signal drops no attempt is made to reconnect the call) and am becoming increasingly frustrated.

[Mark39]

What a foul up, caused by the adviser giving you wrong advice - that should definitely be the focus of your complaint.

I agree with Paul - you will have to give Sky some means of settling your monthly account, before they'll reinstate your service. They won't provide a service if they have no means of obtaining payment for it.

That can be either a direct debit or a continuous credit card payment. Personally I'd steer clear of a continuous credit card authority as you have even less control over these than you do a direct debit.

Sky accounts do occasionally make mistakes, but in my experience, there's no problem in getting them put right although the correction may not appear until the following month. Yes, like many companies, Sky have a cut-off point after which they won't/can't pass amendments to the monthly direct debit.

[Xasperated]

I would have no problem giving Sky some means of settling my account however I have one or two issues with this at the moment:

1. I have offered to set up a standing order for my monthly payments in order that I retain control of my money. As we never use any non-subscription services our monthly bill does not vary.

2. Giving Sky access to my bank account will only allow more mistakes to occur in the future - this can result in extra costs for myself in bank charges, phone calls etc.

3. At the moment I owe Sky nothing until 06 July 2011. This must mean that I have paid for services up until this date and, as long as a mutually acceptable method of Sky receiving payment by this date is in place I cannot understand how they can not allow me full access to all services!

In short I have developed a deep distrust of Sky and it will take a lot to convince me that it is safe to allow them free access to my personal finances.

[Robert]

Hi Xasperated, 

I appreciate that this experience has left you concerned and I'm sorry that you feel you cannot trust Sky. Your services are billed for a month in advance, unfortunately our systems will not allow an account to be re-instated without payment details, there is no way around this.

If you wish to re-instate your account you can do so either by providing Direct Debit or Continuous Credit Card payment details. We no longer invoice or Standing Order as a payment option, this was removed at the beginning of the year.

[Xasperated]

It is Sky's systems that have caused this problem!

If Sky's systems worked then the initial mistake would not have been made!

If Sky's systems worked the mistake could have been rectified earlier!

If Sky's systems worked I would get consistent advice from their employees!

In short, if Sky's systems worked I would be happy!

[StuartD83]

I was not told of the Direct Debit requirement when I signed up.  Surely if payment in advance has been made then services should be supplied, otherwise it is obtaining money by deception or theft.

I am having this same argument with Sky and I will not be paying any more bills because of it.  It's not in the written terms and conditions, nor was it mentioned when I signed up.

Don't charge for a service if you will not supply it when it has clearly been paid for, thats what advance billing is about.  I would understand if it was billing in arrears, then direct debit would be acceptable as only form of payment.  Bye bye Sky, I won't be seeing you again

[muumi-74]

Hey,

I have experienced excatly same, and getting really annoyed that all the progrems I recorded and paid for has been cut off, not only that most of the free channels are not accessable.

I been sky customer for years, and was paying for sky+ for six months after I switched to SKY HD+, yet they are quick claim their monies but when you are due monies from them it takes numerous phone calls and arguements to get your point across. or you to get your moneys back. 

I have now in a point of cancelling and ordering another service from another TV provider.

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Xasperated wrote:

Sky took too much money from our account for 2 months after we downgraded. On noticing this error I called Customer Services and was advised on a course of action which included claiming a payment back from my bank and cancelling the direct debit. I was worried that this may affect my contract or the channels I receive but was assured by more than one adviser that this was the way to progress.

In light of this I must admit to my amazement when I discovered yesterday that our channels were blocked! Not only this we could not record any programmes or even watch anything we had stored even though we had obviously paid for this!

Once again I had to call Sky (at my expense) only to be told that some sort of miscalculation had been made by their advisers and my account was now in debit. As we have no recurring payment set up we could not have our account unblocked unless we agreed to give direct debit instructions over the phone. I have refused to do this as I now have no confidence in Sky's ability to take the correct amount of money from my account. A manager has now removed the debit from our account and, despite admitting we now owe Sky nothing until 06 July 2011 refuses to unblock our account until Sky have details that will enable them to start stealing money from our account again.

On cheecking my acount details on the website this morning I was astounded when it said that I had removed Sky TV!

I am afraid that my recent dealings with Sky have left a very sour taste as I feel we are being blamed for simply following their instructions to remedy their mistake and now they claim we am stuck in to them for another 6 months. Surely Sky are in breach of contract not us!

I have emailed Sky rerarding this matter but 10 days later I am still waiting for the courtesy of a reply.

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